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it’s so funny how for weeks everyone telegraphed “she’s gonna bait him” and her team was like “we’re gonna bait him” and he managed to act normal for like 3 minutes and then she said one thing about his rallies and it was like feeding a gremlin after midnight
Look, I know this is a late response and all but this is serious: it’s feeding a mogwai after midnight that turns it into a gremlin. Gremlin feeding times have no impact on their behavior.
There’s enough fake news and disinformation in the world. You are doing all of us a great service. o7
It will change a lot.
This will dramatically increase the number of Republicans who will tell everyone they’re not voting for him, and then vote for him.
It wasn’t a masterclass. It was functional. What she did masterfully was bait Mangolini into showing how incoherent he really is.
A few Republicans I know said they were going to vote libertarian or just not vote after watching the debate so she did pretty fucking well.
Despite how much they go on about how nuanced and special their views are, libertarians will find a way to vote GOP like they always do.
I’m sure they said that.
I like to lie about things I’m ashamed of too.
“She makes some good points. I might vote for her if she wasn’t a Democrat” - Republicans
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A few Republicans I know said they were going to vote libertarian or just not vote
Very funny that he is straight up Biden-ing himself.
Nope.
Trump fans don’t care.
Harris fans saw confirmation.
Disinterested voters didn’t watch.…and a news media that desperately needs a horse race for clicks will continue to hold Harris to a higher standard than the orange Mr. Magoo.
A convicted rapist literally claimed that you’re allowed to murder babies - then we put them side by side and double check if Harris said something that was slightly exaggerated. What’s so weird about it?
Ajnt Ornj: “
non white‘illegal immigrants’ are literally coming to eat your pets and the democrats want to let them”Media fact checker: "this may not be entirely true, as no evidence has been produced to support the claims, however we found a Twitter post that… "
Harris: “those polling numbers increased by 18%”
Media fact checker: “This is blatantly false. The number actually increased by 17.86%”
Idiots online: BOTH SIDES LIE THEY’RE EXACTLY THE SAME
Really love how y’all have morphed into claiming the lying fake news media is out to get your candidate.
Thing is Trump made his most ridiculous statements highly memeable.
“They’re eating the dogs!” is gonna live on like “They’re turning the fricken frogs gay!”
That might draw enough of the disinterested crowd to figure out what happened that night.
Disinterested voters didn’t watch.
It was a highly entertaining debate. Plenty of folks who dislike them both showed up with big bowls of popcorn to root for injuries. And Trump was true to form, just stepping into rake after rake for the full 90 minutes.
I came to count how many times Trump says “millions and millions”
Precisely. Harris is losing ground nationally and is losing ground in battleground states. Unless this debate significantly moves the needle, which I don’t think it will for the very elegant reasons you summed, current trend lines indicate Harris losing steam and Trump continuing to pick up voters. No amount of wishful thinking will change that.
Fox News poll, right after the debate.
Boomertown.
Fox is conservative STATE propaganda. No different to Russian or North Korean state propaganda. Regardless of the blatant bias, there is literally nothing stopping them from manufacturing this “poll” out of thin air.
Fox isn’t state media. I dislike the mendacious fuckers as much as the next guy but let’s try and stick to facts.
The US has very few state media organizations. Voice of America is one. Radio Free Europe is another.
Fox is an independent organization, if they were state media the Biden admin would have control of their news. That obviously isn’t the case.
The US is a dictatorship of the bourgeoisie and Fox is one of its propaganda arms.
It’s not state propaganda because the state, itself, is subordinate.
You mean oligarchy, not a dictatorship, because a group of people hold power instead of one individual.
A dictatorship isn’t always ruled by a single leader, it can be ruled by a group of leaders. In fact, in practice, every stable dictatorship is ruled by a clique rather than just a single dictator.
People not voting for Harris because of Gaza need to avoid watching the debate, otherwise they’ll change their minds. No matter how bad things are, they can get worse.
Why is it always ‘voters need to lower their standards’, and never ‘candidates need to be decent human beings’?
Because Liberals have always been spineless and will continue to be. There is a parasocial worshiping dynamic how they interact with people in power. Harris just praised a Dick Cheney endorsement. There is no red line for them.
Still not voting for genocide.
If things get worse, we’ll just have to do something other than vote won’t we?
“Still not voting for genocide”
You say as you side with Hamas who openly calls for the genocide of the Jewish race.
They don’t do that these days, and all the people that did are dead at this point. The lifespan for Palestinians is pretty short.
If you don’t want to vote for genocide you need to move to a different country, because that’s never gonna change
I’m right where I need to be. 😉
Guess you’re not voting then.
I was going to write in Aaron Bushnell for President but I think I’ll vote PSL
Aaaaaand that’s a block
God this take is such a loser position. “Fine, I’ll just take my ball and play a different sport!”
Guess what dummy, you’re playing soccer with these Yahoos whether you like it or not so pick a fucking side and THEN ALSO DO MORE."
…burn the fucking barn down with the animals in it, ya dumb bystander…
Guess what dummy, you’re playing soccer with these Yahoos whether you like it
Yeah, actually a lot of us are very aware of the game and how it’s played. Are you? You know most of us aren’t in swing states, right? So what is my protest vote going to affect again? My vote already doesn’t matter in a presidential election. It’s literally never mattered as long as I’ve been a voting adult.
or not so pick a fucking side and THEN ALSO DO MORE."
Yeah I have picked a side. The anti-capitalist side. Which of these parties are anti -capitalist, again?
99% of y’all are calling out this user saying they’ll “do nothing and be smug” instead of voting, but y’all are just gonna vote blue and similarly be smug, do nothing, but continue to run defense for millionaires and one of the most powerful capitalist political parties in the world.
At least this user won’t be doing the latter.
Sitting on the sidelines while the world burns around you and complaining about it is highly effective. Withholding a protest vote (for either side) and supporting voter apathy is lame as hell.
At least when the capitalists are fucking you, regardless of who wins, you can smugly yell “I didn’t consent”.
Withholding a protest vote (for either side) and supporting voter apathy is lame as hell.
What are you talking about? You know there are more than two candidates running, right? I’m literally saying I will be voting third party in a presidential election as I always have, and me voting third party has literally never mattered because the electoral college. Who’s withholding their vote? Although, that doesn’t mean I think voting in a bourgeois democracy is actually a meaningful expression of political power and organization.
You’re all hand winging about people on the left who just don’t want to vote Democrat, again even in states where the result is already known. You can’t even dare to criticize Democrats or send any message even in safe states like CA, WA, or NY. Because the handful of conscientious leftists are definitely gonna flip CA red or could definitely flip MS blue if they sucked it up and went for Kamala.
When the capitalists continue to fuck us , you’ll have done fuck all to push socialism because you spend all your time, again, running defense for one of the two most powerful capitalist institutions in the world.
In a fptp system, only the two main candidates matter once the primaries are done.
We know this.
In an electoral college system, only swing states matter.
But parties will pay attention if votes are siphoned from them. If you’re not in a swing state, a third party vote has basically no negative effect but may have a positive effect of influencing a major party.
I think it’s more than arguable that voting for Kamala in Louisiana or Mississippi or even potentially California is a bigger waste of a vote than voting third party.
Genocide isn’t on the ballet
It is if you don’t vote for the two genocidal candidates. There are non genocidal choices, even if they’re just protest votes.
Don’t cut off your nose to spite your face.
Don’t support genocide.
I haven’t seen a single soul on here support genocide. I do see a lot of people encouraging you to not take the easy way out.
What, are you gonna be on the front lines with your guns shooting? The overwhelming majority of people with this mindset have never held a firearm in their entire lives and have no idea what they’re even talking about. What are you even insinuating here? Is your end goal that we burn the entire country down because “wahhhhh both sides aren’t perfect”? Grow up, only children refuse to see greater good through compromise because they can’t see past not getting what they want. Single issue voters love to stick their head in the sand and pretend the one issue that they’re whinging about is the most important in the world.
Have fun standing on your “genocide” comment when you’re in a fascist dictatorship run by nazis. “but but but the genocide wah”
I’m insinuating that we can become ungovernable and force the government to capitulate to our demands. Mass protest, general strike, public disruptions, boycott, we have options to fight back.
Instead of just voting every couple years.
But instead you’ll do nothing, and feel smug about it.
I donate to bail funds and support resistance groups financially, because I live in the middle of fucking nowhere and there aren’t protests for me to join.
So you support genocide because you live “nowhere”? OK.
Yeah I’m pretty pathetic - I’m doing as much to stop genocide as you are to stop Trump lol
Start one then if you feel that strongly about what’s going on in Gaza
Oh come on, that’d expose them to actual risk from their neighbors who likely don’t share their views, and they surely cannot do that. Except when they become ungovernable when things get worse partially because of their vote, and then they’ll magically be capable of winning a revolution or whatever.
How many hours have you volunteered for Harris? Don’t you want to stop Trump?
You’re organizing those things, or at least joining others who are organizing, right?
As much as we can, plus financial support.
But I’m not going to organize a protest in a rural cornfield lol
So you support genocide because you live in a cornfield? Cool.
It’s not like you’re out there fucking volunteering for Harris anyway. Do you want Trump to win??? 🙄
Why not both?
Go ahead.
But I’m not voting for genocide. I’d rather die.
Hey guess what? Fascists dont give a fuck about that shit, youll end up in a puddle of your own blood cause ya wont have the numbers. If it didnt work out for the fighters at Blair mountain a hundred year ago what makes ya think youll achieve anything.
Fuck ya’d have a better chance doing random acts of terrorism that put the fucken IRA to shame. Still probably end up in a ditch but you could probably kill some of the ones trying to kill you.
If you actually believed this sky is falling bullshit you’d be doing a hell of a lot more than voting. Do you even own a gun? lol
EDIT sorry don’t answer that. What I mean I, I doubt you own a gun because you do not believe you’d ever need one, because you do not believe fascism is actually coming. This is all rhetoric.
Fuck ya’d have a better chance doing random acts of terrorism that put the fucken IRA to shame. Still probably end up in a ditch but you could probably kill some of the ones trying to kill you.
We don’t talk about that on Lemmy.
Im a Redneck, course I own a fucken gun. But heres the thing the Republicans are a party of fucken fascists, even if they dont get as bad as I suspect theyll still most likely use the police to gun down protesters and strikers. I just aint an idiot who assumes shit will work out, so I take every fucken step I can to keep the worst from happening. “Prepare for war hope for peace” is a pretty solid summary of alot of my philosophy.
I assume for the worst and the worst involves concentration camps, firing lines, and the destruction of civil liberties. Sure ya can probably take out the local police with an ad hoc militia, but can ya take out say an SS or SA equivalent? What about the National guard or the military itself? Cause my rough guess is that the corruption would take about ten years minimum to destroy the professionalism and tech advantage of the US military.
Voting costs nothing and depending on where one lives can have an outsized impact.
You first.
That’s… Not how it works?
We do it together…
Over people dying in another country? And not for important things like disenfranchising and taxes?
Yikes. Genocide is pretty fucking important.
Important, but not to the level of civil disobedience like when we protested police abuse and systemic racism. Like a 4/10 judging by people’s actions.
2023 was the most deadly year for police shootings. Systemic racism and police abuse didn’t go away. Yet, no one is in the street.
Why do you think that is?
Democracy exist so we don’t have to reach that point, please, go vote.
Democracy exist
Half the presidents in my lifetime lost the popular vote.
Did she? I listened to the debate and she sounded mid for most of it. She spent more time attacking Trump than she did answering the questions she was asked.
Sure, she fared better than her predecessor, but “not shitting her pants” is a low bar. Trump was definitely worse than her, but again, if the bar is “don’t act butthurt when your opponent says your rallies are boring”, then congrats, I guess.
Reading comments from both sides, it seems that the left sees her not being geriatric as a win; and the right thinks that Trump was unjustly treated (targeted questions, live fact-checking, etc…), which is absurd considering that (a) they also asked Harris difficult questions (fracking and Israel, for example, which she did have a hard time answering), and (b) he was given free reign to talk out of order more times than I can count.
I think Harris “won” because Trump sucked. He sidestepped questions regarding an abortion ban (“I haven’t talked with JD about it” fucking lol) and Ukraine (“Do you want Ukraine to win the war?” “I want the war stopped” TWICE in a row, followed by “I know Putin really well” and a rant about the awesomeness of Victor Orban); he repeatedly told lies (post-birth abortion and pets-eating immigrants being the highlight) which were promptly caught by the live fact-checker, and even showed weakness and undecisiveness (“do you have a plan?” “I have concepts of a plan”).
But those are blunders that Trump committed, not something that Harris should take credit for. Nothing I heard screamed of “masterclass” debate, and I doubt that it will give her an edge in the upcoming elections or sway electors one way or the other. After all, the people who lived under four years of Trump’s presidency and watched January 6th unfold live, and still call themselves “undecided” are pretty much lying to themselves at this point.
Enlightened centrist bullshit
For fuck’s sake, y’all should stop this “enlightened centrist” bullshit whenever someone is slightly critical of the leftist candidate.
Trump sucks. It’s incredible that he’s even allowed to be a candidate for presidency after the shit he’s done. He’s dangerous for the US and dangerous for the democracy of the entire world. If there’s some justice left in the US system, he will lose the elections and he will pay for his crimes.
Not liking Harris’ speech doesn’t make me an “enlightened centrist”. It just means that I don’t think her words were strong enough, or bold enough, to win her new voters, which should be the point of the presidential debate. I think she won because Trump’s ineptitude will bleed him some voters, but I’m not willing to credit that to Harris’ speech skills.
Have you considered stopping the enlightened centrist bullshit instead?
Kamala Harris is not a leftist.
This is sealioning
This is a leftist being extremely fucking mad that liberals are wrapping themselves in our colors and calling themselves “left” and “progressive” and shit.
